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And climatesdope ,the toonude2 and littletommy49, says it"s all a Dem Hoax. Too funny with those mentally challenged losers we contend with. They need to be banned from the fine quality Tribune. Just don't print any stupid utterance they want to spew. Wisco only had 22 deaths yesterday. That ain"t many right? They neeed to be banned !!!
Can't believe how many idiots in this town think the virus is gone,can't see it,can't be there,I now know someone who has died from it,you go in stores and feel like an idiot for wearing a mask,then I think,who cares I don't know them any way better to be safe than sorry.
213 Countries and Territories around the world have reported a total of 5,756,416 confirmed cases as of 3 hours ago & Climate Hoax actually believes this is all to take down Donald Trump? Wow, that's a real stretch, close to insane thoughts, to imagine someone actually believes this nonsense.
Amen, Daisy. We as a nation are in trouble if this corrupt idiot can sneak another victory with the help of the Electoral College. There's not much we can do about it until the College bites the behinds of the conservatives and they scream about its unfairness to them. It is unfair to everybody. It is time for America to recognize this.
“Doing what feels good, what’s convenient, what’s easy — that’s how little kids think, unfortunately, a lot of so-called grown-ups, including some with fancy titles and important jobs, still think that way — which is why things are so screwed up. I hope that instead, you decide to ground yourself in values that last, like honesty, hard work, responsibility, fairness, generosity, respect for others.” Barack Obama
A lot of people defend the idiot now residing in the White House because he is "so plain-spoken" and "tells it like it is". The problem is that he speaks mainly in lies. Mr. Celery quotes a former leader who is plain-spoken and in words that resonate in truth, rather than deception. Oh to have another leader in the White House like that again.
Obama resonates truth?? Read Fo, you’ll find out he’s a crooked scoundrel, respoDi le for setting up an innoccent man and sending him to jail, among other unsavory things.
He just slick, and slippery like Bill Clinton, that pat on your back s a knife being stabbed in
Whoa! Climate, from the looks of your 5:07pm, these are not just ordinary typos. You either hit the bottle to hard in your stay-at-home blues, or you injected Lysol, or you have listened too often to our great national leader, to the point of now doing a dead-on impression of him as you write.
The pandemic hits home, the headline sounds like something MSNBC would conjure up to scare everyone.
You are one of those who has been bellowing that the pandemic has had little impact on the country, Climate. There have been nine new confirmed cases in the last two days. That is nine hits from the pandemic rather close to home, is it not? In fact right IN the home. D'ya think perhaps the pandemic has been more active in the county population already, but there has been inadequate testing to measure and trace it, Climate? Why would that be, after the president has told us over and over again that we have enough testing, that anybody who wants a test can get it? Is the county health department at fault, or is the president lying, as he is so wont to do? Any thoughts, Climate?
Our bodies won’t build up antibodies if were not exposed. If a person could keep their home germ free while the kids are growing up they would end up being sickly for the rest of their lives. What doesn’t kill you makes you stronger. The fact that many more people have the virus that aren’t showing symptoms is a good thing.
Where did you get nine new cases? An article in this paper says 4, must be the liberal spin on the numbers, lies in other words.
9 new cases in like the last 3 days,pretty high!
With no deaths, the numbers are still insignificant
Keep moving the goal line, Climate. Makes you look as inherently dishonest as you have always proven yourself to be.
The whole concept of herd immunity is one that is linked to effective vaccines. It is true that historically before the invention of medicine human beings gradually developed herd immunity to deadly diseases, but it took the horrible decimation of huge parts of populations before it happened.
Why do you think it took so long for humans to populate the world? Through much of human history people must have developed herd immunity to polio after it took a terrible toll on humanity. When first massive public health efforts to remove raw sewage from cities and towns with sewer systems, it had the unexpected drawback of removing casual, constant exposure to polio for several generations, and we as a result had polio pandemics through much of the first half of the 20th century. It was because there no longer was a herd immunity. It was not restored until effective vaccines were developed by Salk and Sabin.
If we do what you recommend, let Covid-19 run its course without taking precautions, perhaps a herd immunity two or three years down the road would come about, but not until tens of millions perished, taking down the world economy with it as hundreds of millions died globally.
You are quite cavalier with your opinions and projections. All I would advise to anybody listening to you is to look at the screen name you have chosen for yourself, and you will understand "cavalier" is much too elegant a world to use in connection to your ignorance.
The county has recorded 35 COVID-19 cases, 28 of which are considered recovered. There has been one coronavirus-related hospitalization. There have been no COVID-19 deaths reported of La Crosse County residents.
I copied this from another article on this site.
It’s unconscionable to ruin businesses over such paltry virus numbers
Open the state up, NOW! This is a power grab by the mayors and governors, mostly Rats.
Yes, isn't it outrageous, Climate? Have you been tested yet? Do you know where you can go to get tested on demand? Do you think health authorities in the country are confident that they know where the virus is present and that they have the resources to test and track it s that everything can open up again? How about the White House, where people are tested constantly, and still two people this week came down with the virus, two people who daily were around the president, vice president and the entire Covid-19 team. That Trump. He really has a handle on this pandemic. You should listen to him and run in the other direction. Not likely, however, for a person who uses the screen name that you have chosen for yourself. You and bozo form a dynamic duo on these boards. With new2, you could form a hilarious comedy trio. I can't think of an appropriate name for such an act, but perhaps something that combines the words "Three" and the word "Stooges".
People waste most of their lives worrying about maladies that never occur. You libs are good at that. But worrying about people loosing their lively hoods, or being taxed into the poor house because of lunatic liberal ideas, then you aren’t concerned. You best use some common sense( I know you don’t have much) and prioritize what’s vital to keeping our country running.
Oh? With a screen name like Climatehoax, I guess you are privy to how most people spend most of their lives worrying about maladies that never occur? How about a malady that in the last two months has hit more than a million people in this country and killed nearly 90,000 of them, a malady for which there is no known cure and has proven itself to be highly effective at spreading silently and invisibly through the population, Climate? Tell us in reassuring tones how silly it is to worry about something like that. Until Covid-19, I can't recall another disease in my relatively long life that I "wasted my time" worrying about since the polio epidemics in the 1950s that were striking down, crippling and killing kids in my neighborhood when I was a grade schooler. Tell me about some other diseases that you think I might have spent too much time worrying about, Climate. On the other hand, don't. Your hot, empty air is annoying and stinks.
Well when the numbers go back up after re opening too fast watch for another shut down..soon.
The cases from surrounding counties probably are being treated in our county,how about the people that carry the virus with no symptoms but are spreaders,plus those that remain home with no diagnosis for many different reasons includine no isurance,plus possible deaths from the virus that were never confirmed,the numbers are much higher then confirmed numbers.
No, it’s been determined the numbers nation wide are greatly exaggerated. Biden himself said over a million people have died, heck, I bet it’s not over 970,000 yet. He sure is presidential material.
Who, pray tell, has determined that the numbers nationally are greatly exaggerated, Climate? Show us where you got that information.
Biden jumbles his speech at times, but he does not try to cover it up with lies, like Trump. This seems to be where you are taking this misinformation you are trying to peddle, from a right-wing propaganda sheet:
In the latest faux pas, which was made during a live streamed “virtual roundtable” on PBS, Biden babbled: "We're ... in the middle of a pandemic that has cost us more than 85,000 jobs as of today.
"Lives of millions of people. Millions of people. Millions of jobs."
I don't see him saying millions have died. He is saying millions of people without completing the thought, which it is fair to assume millions of peoples' lives have been disrupted. You are putting the words you want into his mouth.
Climate has decided to run for the weeds and hide, I take it, rather than tell us who "determined" that the Covid-19 numbers are greatly exaggerated. I would be embarrassed, too, to admit that I believed the man with the orange face and the ridiculous duck tail comb over who resides in the White House.
isn't it ironic that bill maher, who has been advocating for a recession for over two years as the way for dems to regain the WH, is now calling the coverage by the 'news' media of the virus "panic p o r n"?
I dunno, bozo. I never watch Naher, who I think is smug and over-rated. I try to ge my information from sources that carefully vet the information they are reporting. Is that how you keep yourself informed, watching entertainment shows like Maher and Fox News? It sounds like something a bozo would do.
Dont be fooled. Lacrosse is only testing you if you are in health care, underllying conditions, travel or known exposure or extreme sickness. have been sick 3 weeks. Went to doctor was told i had all the symptoms but diidnt fit criteria to have the test. It is around here more than we know.
No. No. No. This is NOT possible, Lucky! I have not had the opportunity to listen to our gracious and courageous president, Donald John Trump, giving his scintillating press conference this afternoon. But just yesterday I heard him saying that the U.S. has tested more people for Covid-19 than any other country in the world, and that, furthermore, through his keen and powerful response to the pandemic, he has seen to it that millions upon millions of test kits are being distributed throughout the nation every day. Not only that, they are great tests. The best tests in the world, actually. Probably the most perfect tests ever devised. It's a tremendous thing to see. The governors and the doctors all over the country are standing up and cheering the effort he has overseen and the tremendous, timely help that he has personally saw to it gets to every nook and cranny in the land, so that if you need a test, you can have a test. Do you mean to dispute the president of the United States? I suppose, though I shudder to have such a thought, that he could be wrong on this. If he is, I am sure he will follow in the footsteps of Barack Obama, who once misstated about Obamacare that if you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor. When that turned out to wrong, Obama publicly apologized for making the statement. I am SURE, if this is the case with Donald Trump, he will very publicly admit that the national effort to have adequate testing for Covid-19 has come up short, and apologize for saying otherwise. I am SURE he will.
saw, seen. I have read to many of new2's missives and have caught his bad English virus.
let's see......hmm....the population of lax county is a little over 115k....and there are 26 cases...….that works out to about 99.98% (rounded off of course), of the population has caught nothing.
I believe mikeinona has a message for you directly below, bozo.
I miss the pre-internet days when I had no idea how irredeemably ignorant so many of my fellow human beings were. I'm going to live out my golden days with the squirrels.
Oh well aren't you just special and elite and God's gift...
Good, you’ll have an equivalent IQ.
As a dental professional I would like to say that there are some offices open. We too are on are the front lines to keep people with toothaches out of the ER so ER can concentrate on the Virus.
Thank you. You are, indeed, taking a risk in the name of public service and are to be commended.
Dear Editors, I think you can turn off the comment section now.
Stay safe everyone. God bless our health care workers and THANK YOU for all you do. [thumbup]
Yes, please! I agree!
You are free to ignore them...
It's impossible to ignore YOU and the other nincompoops who constantly clutter up the comment sections with your childish partisan drivel.
Then by all means, contribute. If you think you are the only one entitled to an opinion, well we'll just see about that...
While I believe Monteee and I have opinions that closely align, in this case, I have to agree with D. The board is open to all comers. It is pretty easy to neutralize D's constant misinformation. No problem there.
Your blessing of healthcare workers is fine, Billy. But I listen to Trump get on the t.v. every day and read lists of how many hundreds of this item "his" team is delivering to some place in the U.S., how many thousands to that, what is coming in June or July and so on and so forth. Sounds good. Probably good enough that his approval rating has crept nearly 50 percent. But when you read newspapers from around the country, every hospital in every place is crying in desperation because they can't get masks, can't get ventilators, can't get gowns and so on and so forth. And the crush on hospitals apparently is just beginning, probably about to got up to impossible numbers in the next couple of weeks. It is a national tragedy, but in terms of equipping our health care workers properly, we would be a lot closer to it today and going forward if Trump had rallied the nation two months ago instead of sloughing off the pandemic as a no show in this country. His own medical advisors were begging him to get ready back then, and he ignored them, as he apparently ignores all expert and all scientific advice. So, no, it is now more than ever that the comment section should be here up and running at full force. Tell me how I am wrong to think so.
Oh Homeyboy, why on earth would they want to shut down this informative and delightful comment board?! You're the sunrise in the morning, the glitter on a rainbow, with your positive vibe and hopeful attitude you should actually apply to be a host on "The View". You could sit right between Whoopi Goldberg and Joy Behar and bash "you know who" with the best of them! You could even take johnb.braggert with you as a color commentator,,,Well probably not, his Mom probably won't let him out of the basement. So anyway, did you know 1.25 MILLION people die in auto accidents each year?!! Now that's an eye opening number! Know anyone who has quit driving because of that? No. Own a car? Yes. Part of the problem? Probably. All Trump's fault? I'd imagine, but I'll have to check with The Huffington Post and CNN first. Back away from the computer, go outside using your social distancing skills, and soak in some nice spring sunshine. The vitamin D you absorb not only will help your anxiety and depression, it will boost your old immune system to help fight off "The Virus" Good Luck, God Bless, Stay Positive
No time for a full 'blown" effeminate hissy fit ., especially in the middle of a War. A million Americans dead as doornails, is the Orange Carcass Bastid"s fault, "cos it is merely a Dem Hoax Scandal. Your attention span ain"t that short ....or is it? Time for ya'll to get young , just like the young ladies ,in their tight knickers, who live around me. Ya"ll don"t know what you"re missing , but it must really suck to be you. Ya think? Get young , it is better for your heart and a lot more fun. It is called the "trump virus", by the way, but ya"ll knew that "going in".
Well, Talks, I fully endorse DMoney's 12:29pm post, and as you may know, he and I rarely see eye to eye. If you do not like what you are reading here and what I have to say, you are very much free to skip over it and ignore it.
If the message you hear from the president in his daily briefings is what lifts your spirits and gives you hope, by all means, drink them in deep, grateful drafts. But it must puzzle you somewhat, I would think, that he says one thing one day and contradicts the next.
You must be dizzy from following him around in circles by now. That must be the reason that you seem awfully confused here about what is going on. My recommendation is that you stop reading and listening to Covid-19 news and opinion for a day or two, get lots of rest, and stay as far away from people as you can until you get your wits back. That way you will do no harm to others or to yourself. Good luck.
Just think of how far ahead we would be as a country on this issue if the Obama Administration had an ample supply of ventilators, masks. The states also have a responsibility to assure safety is first and foremost thought in the workplace, OSHA requires safety equipment to be available to handle emergency’s. There is ample evidence that the governor of New York chose not to purchase ventilators when he had the opportunity to do so, he has failed his state and is now looking for other states to send ventilators to New York. He refused to talk about this on several recent interviews, he says it’s no time to be placing on who is to blame. This may be true but you can bet it will be time soon enough and for him, it won’t be good. Trump has relied on Dr. fauci and his team and you can bet he is running the show, Trump has said as much. The early China ban was Trumps but as you seen and heard, Democrats seem to think it was a racist move, so I think no matter what is being done will be seen as have been the wrong move. Go figure.
You realize you aren't forced to read comments you don't like... right?
Editors, I agree. Disable comments on this one. [thumbup]
Why are you for that, Fidel? Is the frustration of being on the wrong side getting so painful that you can't bear it anymore? Is the truth so obvious now, and it is so opposite to what you had wanted it to be that you don't want to be reminded of how badly you have been gulled by Trump? Relax. It wasn't exactly your fault, as you have been fooled once on this. But if you get fooled twice by it, then it is your fault, as the old saying goes. I see you are enamored of emoticons, like another frequent visitor to this site. Hmm.
Tribune Editors! Will you PLEASE turn off comments to stop this childish nonsense?
Why are you on here reading it, Francie? Why would anybody read anything they deemed childish nonsense?
Free country, unless a Rat wins the White House. Don’t read them, if you don’t like them.
trump"s got a very small vocabulary and brings daily willfull ignorance to "work" with him. 60% of his gig is done as ,what he calls : "Executive Time", 60% of the time eating Big Macs, golfing or playing reality TV and watching Fox Fake. He has a very easy job. Barack Obama often did ,at the very least, 12 -14 hour days. the Orange Carcass is more like a temporary worker. He needs to hit up with Kelly Girl, where he would be qualified.
These comments might be readable except they have devolved into a pissing contest between maybe a half dozen individuals, all who are convinced they have the answers and cannot possibly be wrong.
I might agree with you, elocs, but I get on here when I see people telling the rest of us what to think when what they think is based on false information. That, in this age of gathering bad information from the internet, is something that has to be objected to at every turn. We cannot face the future when half the people are basing their decisions on total unreality. If you think this is politicizing, so be it. It is not. I am not offering answers, nor do I by any stretch of the imagination think that I could possibly be wrong. I am wrong often, and I try to acknowledge that on these boards when I am. If you do not want to weigh in on what is going on, that is your privilege. To take potshots from the peanut gallery at those who do is, I am guessing, your way of saying your side does not have the facts on its side, so you will just pretend to be above it all.
Well, you are factually wrong about Trump's handling of this situation. Judging by his ratings and the generally supportive feedback coming from even his most ardent critics (except Pelosi, the poster child if partisan dissent). In reality, he's dealing with a historically unprecedented situation with a complexity level the likes we haven't seen since WW2 or maybe the worst days if the cold war. He was unprepared, as was 98% of countries on Earth. I think your confusion comes from what his role and the role of the federal government is. It's not to become dictators and abandon the Constitution. It's not to supercede states and their responsibilities. It's not to create panic and overstate the danger. It is to manage teams of experts in all fields and ensure a balance between safety and the economy at the highest level. He's doing that. You also continuously confuse words with actions. We all know and have known since beyond the past 4 years that Trump says stupid and outlandish things. We all wish he wouldn't. But his actions are what counts. Results matter. He's delivered them and continues to do so.
dnomey is too funny , though he loves to swallow....each and every misinformation , the Orange Carcass Bastid rams down his esophagus. This lowlife could be told the :"the sky is falling" and he"d believe every lie and deception trump"d spew.trump botched the whole gig from the day he was relieved of federal prosecution and impeachment.It must've got in his way, "cos trump can"t walk and chew gum at the same time. It"s trump"s virus, or nobody"s He dragged his feet. To him, it is still a :Dem Hoax Scandal". dmoney has a short attention span. Gotta wonder what he will tell his daughters, when they ask their dead-beat Dada "bout grabbing women around the same organ his daughters have. He never thought about that.
Over and over every single day. You’re just noticing this?
How about contributing rather than just whining?
I did contribute! I agreed with elocs. If you don't like my opinion, as you said, don't read it. How about not whining about it?
What's the point of repeating the same opinion over and over and over? It's become noise which and makes it impossible to hear anyone else and devolved into a childish pissing contest between a couple of insecure little children. I am truly interested in reading these comments, including those from both you and oldhomey but there is a line that both of you crossed days ago. Share your opinion but then for God's sake shut up!
Francesca, I am being sincere here. I try to engage people who are trying to pass off misinformation as the truth. I am extremely worried about what the internet has done to silo people into their own echo chambers, so that much of public opinion today is based on misinformation. I hope that my comments on here are an honest effort to do that, but you are saying I stepped over the line. If I have done that, I would appreciate hearing from you what it is that I did wrong. I realize I can get a little too enthusiastic in this quest, so if I am going beyond the bounds of taste or fairness, I would like to know. But be specific.
How about contributing your thoughts and opinions?
Well, D, I am SO grateful for your generous off asking me about my thoughts and opinions on this. I will, if I may, quote you first, and then share my thoughts and opinions on what you have to say:
"He was unprepared, as was 98% of countries on Earth. I think your confusion comes from what his role and the role of the federal government is. It's not to become dictators and abandon the Constitution. It's not to supercede states and their responsibilities. It's not to create panic and overstate the danger. It is to manage teams of experts in all fields and ensure a balance between safety and the economy at the highest level. He's doing that."
Yes, Trump was monumentally unprepared for this. He was even less well-prepared than he could have been because he was busy dismantling and decimating our federal healthcare infrastructure in his first three years in office. Should you require some evidence to back up my assertion on this, let me know, I will happily provide it for you, but, as you may recall, I have done this repeatedly already. But beyond that, we don't expect presidents to be ready for any contingency that can happen on their watch. But we should expect them to listen to and heed the infrastructure and experts that the government maintains for these purposes, and, though he had weakened it for three years, it had people in place who could and tried to fill him in on the needed information when Covid-19, and he, typically, chose not to, instead following his gut feelings while you cheered him on.
This is a time when all levels of American society should be doing what must be done to stop the spread of this disease. The states -- those entities you pretend to nobly defend here, are begging the president to for the purposes of this fight install federal regulations on the manufacture, stockpiling and distribution of vital medical equipment and supplies that each state now finds itself having to fight every other state in procurement of these desperately needed items, allowing prices to grow as exponentially as the disease, benefiting only craven profiteers, not people or taxpayers. And what is the president doing? Refusing to step in. He is, after all, a self-styled crafty businessman. He is striking a balance? What balance and to whose advantage in a crisis like this.
"He's doing that." I have a far different idea of what he is doing than what yours seems to be. I can point to exactly what is going on, backed by quotations of Trump himself. What have you got in your quiver?
Our great and glorious leader, Donald John Trump, who has been SO constant and consistent in his messaging on the Covid-19 pandemic since it first crossed the radar in January, Sunday decided going back to work by Easter maybe was not such a good idea, extending the lockdown to the end of April. He slightly altered his predictions from February and March that the pandemic was no problem here, totally under control to yesterday discussing the possibility that we are facing 100,000 to 200,000 deaths. It is so comforting that we have a commander in chief in charge who makes studied, informed decisions that need to be made, willing to accept the responsibility for his decisions. I guess his idea of being a man for all seasons is to make every possible decision that can be made, good, bad and indifferent, and then, in the aftermath, he will claim whichever one seemed to be right, denying he had anything to do with the decisions that were wrong. Wasn't his fault. No sirree.
What can be done about those employers who either through arrogance or ignorance are not allowing their employees who could work from home to do so.
I can only speak from personal experience. At my small company, we offered everyone to work from home. Only one person opted to. Many people value their freedom and normalcy and prefer maintaining it even in the face of illness or possibly even death. Not saying that's "right" but that's the feedback I've gotten. In two weeks, "quarantine fatigue" will combine with horrible economy and you'll see the majority of people feel this way.
I can see your point but I disagree. This thing hasn't really hit us yet. I can imagine in two weeks the toilet paper hoarders missing their bar stools and table service will get quarantine fatigue. That seems natural but unfortunately selfish and short-sighted.
This strategy isn't really about those people who prefer to maintain normalcy. There is nothing normal about this situation. The current strategy is to flatten the potential infection surge so won't overwhelm the limited resources available to treat sick people. A little time may make a difference in getting more masks to hospitals or finding answers and treatments which we do not have right now at this moment. We have 5 confirmed cases in La Crosse County? Calm before the storm? Who knows? I predict it will get much worse before it gets better. It will get worse because of "quarantine fatigue" and we're only a week in!
What we know about this virus outbreak changes daily. A few people deciding this is too inconvenient for them might mean the sacrifices so many people have made were for nothing.
Fidel, you are making me reconsider my assumption that you and crank are one and the same. This was a well-informed and reasonable response and explanation. Nobody knows, obviously, what is in store vis a vis the future with coronavirus. What our friend Dmoney simply cannot seem to fathom is the dynamics of a pandemic like this once a virus has hit a critical mass in the human population, the stunning rapidity of how it spreads. The first case was revealed in China last Dec. 1. It quickly started spreading throughout the world, so that by early March this year, there were 100,000 cases diagnosed worldwide, but the likelihood was that it was many times that number. By late last week, Mar. 18, the confirmed worldwide cases were 200,000. Yesterday it went to 300,000. It will probably double every three days now according mathematical models. By April Fool's Day, the day our president celebrates apparently 365 days a year -- 366 this year as a personal bonus to him -- it will be in the millions. Is that simply because more testing is finally being done? We should all hope so, but probably not.
Anyway, if you are not crank, I apologize for categorizing you in that way. We already have had strong differences of opinion, so I would imagine an apology from me won't mean much, but it is sincere.
Could not be more Spot-on, correct and exact.!!! If one was to listen to trump it would be over by Easter........2024. It is going to get worse.
I fully understand and comprehend the medical situation. I'm saying that in a couple more weeks, we won't care. By we I mean society. There will come a point very soon where a general consensus and understanding will be made among society and government that we must press on. There will be no choice. It will come down to facing the risk and consequences or set ourselves back 59 years economically. I guarantee you, we'll take the risk. 3 5 million already newly unemployed, that number will double just like coronavirus infections has and will have a far greater and more lasting impact.
Yes, our resident scientist/philosopher/humanitarian DMoney has surveyed the landscape and has issued his opinion: It is better to let people go back to work and spread a deadly virus that will, left unchecked, kill possibly hundreds of thousands in this country alone. So what if a few hundred thousand die, so long as we keep the Dow Jones up? That's the important thing, and, besides, an awful lot of those who will die will be old folks and people with compromised health to start with -- the type of people who made bad choices in their lives.
And, though he has not said it directly in his 11:51am post, he will tell you that it is in the best interests of the nation to by whatever means necessary maintain the president who misdirected and lied about this crisis from Day One. Re-electing him is key, because, gosh, it is the almighty buck that is most important, folks. It trumps even your loved ones, I guess, when you have a mind like D's.
You do understand that for a country or society to function, there must be money, right? You understand where money comes from? You understand that a vaccine for this won't be readily available for a year? Now put that all together and you'll see I'm obviously, clearly correct. There's no other way. This isn't my opinion it preference--it's elementary logic. Society can't possibly be locked down for an extended time before it ceases to function.
D, I understand that the collapsing stock market has dissolved hundreds of thousands of dollars of my retirement savings. I will be all right. I will survive, but I may yet have to dip into the principle because of how the economy is shredding the lives of my sons and their families, and I may have to help them until this is over.
Don't try to lecture me about money.
I know it is the be all and end all to you, but to me it is not. You STILL have failed to show that you understand is the dynamics of a particularly vicious viral pandemic, which Covid-19 is. I am not waiting for a vaccine to stop it, and I never gave the slightest indication that I was. The most critical two months of this pandemic in this country are the next two months. Either we take steps to stop the transmission of it, or it will run rampant through our population, striking down tens of millions of people, killing lord knows how many. You want to see the economy come to a full stop? Let that happen. Do you want to see the spirit ripped out of the heart of a nation? Let millions of people see our hospitals overwhelmed, underprepared to even protect their own personnel. Let people see grandparents and other elderly relatives -- not to mention people of all ages with compromised immune systems -- be told that they will die because there are not enough ventilators to go around, and they are denied access to one because other people have a greater claim to saving their lives. So, yeah, D, by all means, let's open up the factories, stores and restaurants to try to shorten the recessionary economy. Good call. Right.
Chuck Norris is on my side. End of conversation. Go Google it.
Chuck Norris, you say? Well, then, I better stand down. Case closed.
He is indeed. And I knew you knew who that was. Everyone knows and respects Chuck Norris. He tested positive for Coronavirus... and the virus had to self quarantine for 14 days.
In seriousness, I've stated before I don't care about retirement funds in this thing. I care about mortgage and food payments. The essentials. People will be hard pressed to afford them after government money runs out--or after they blow their money on non essential purchases which absolutely will happen. The government may come up with further trillions. But it's not unlimited and those trillions they are spending is FUTURE economic activity that we SHOULD be participating in. Reduce that anticipated activity and those trillions are unaccounted for. That leads to debilitating inflation, lower credit with foreign countries (China). Will result in economic depression that blows away anything we've ever seen. This happens if we remain in this type of lockdown for over 3-4 months. There's simply not enough money and economic activity to sustain it--regardless of the risks or consequences we face.
This is economics. This is reality. This is logic. There is no "data" to validate it as we've never faced this before. But the simple truth is that regardless of the medical situation and risks, any lockdown to the world's largest economy must be extremely limited.
I know Chuck Norris, D. I am not sure I know why I should regard him with any particular respect. He may be a fabulous human being, for all I know, but he is famous for being a wooden, third-rate actor who is good in martial arts and stars in third-rate action movies. Or have I missed something? Are they high art in your estimation? I am sorry he tested positive for Covid-19. How did he get to the head of the line for testing? I hope he makes a full recovery.
I don't need anybody, particularly you, to explain to me the serious economic threat the shutdown represents. You, in particular, should listen more carefully to the medical experts. The way to minimize the length of the shutdown is to enforce it now, so that it works, not by hysterically lifting it to get the economy up and running, letting the virus loose and running unimpeded through the population.
Prairie, what can be done is to go to another company that would value you, and then the foolish one can let the free market bring them new workers after their reputation is shot. Best of luck to you...be well.
Prairie, people don't medically isolate themselves, it is done under strict medical supervision. If people test positive for the virus, medical authorities inventory who they have had recent contact with and those people are duly alerted to be on alert themselves. This is a good time to also respond to this post elsewhere from Dmoney:
"DMoney Mar 19, 2020 12:50pm
"I will be working out of my home until such time where it's illegal to do so. While I have sympathy for those whom face true risk from this virus--I care about the welfare of my family more. Therefore as long as it's legal to work, I must commute. I must get gas in my vehicle, purchase food, etc. Therefore I am exposed to other human beings. If we (society) knows where to avoid contamination-- it will expose less people to areas where people are known to be sick. Again, I don't want names, addresses, details, gender, age of these people. I want to know where they've been and who they've come in contact with. Not specifics, but general areas. When I read that Onalaska school district might have been exposed--well now I'll go to the Holmen Festival foods vs. Onalaska location. I AM going, until I am forced to remain in my home."
D, you seem to have the same grasp on this virus thing that the leader whom you admire so much, Donald John Trump, has grasped it. Knowing that somebody who tested positive at such and such a Kwik Trip or Mobil gas station is no protection at all. The virus is everywhere, and likely people who have tested or will soon test positive for it have been to every gas station in the region, probably in many multiples. Of course people still have to get gas, and they should get gas. But they should get it using the recommended safeguards of hand washing and subsequent cleaning of surfaces.
And you set yourself up as some sort of martyr to your family, that you are going out into the world in defiance of some uncaring, autocratic government. If the government has not said to close your business due to the pandemic, by all means keep it going. But you have the wrong attitude, much like your great leader does, about this. We all put our families first, and by realizing that we are all in this fight together, by adhering to the public health principles and rules set forth by medical authorities, we presumably will blunt the spread of the virus, thus protecting everybody's family. If you go it alone, you protect nobody, including your own family. Grow up, straighten up and fly right. For weeks you have been falsely accusing others of declaring that the sky is falling, and now you are guilty of doing that very thing.
You are telling us (I say us, because on this subject you are clearly in the vast minority judging by the number and variance of people wanting more details in these comments) that it is useless to avoid areas where there was known exposure to the virus? Are you serious Clark? (that's from an 80's movie, maybe you've seen it). If it didn't help to know where to avoid, why do you think they investigate where these people have been? Why do they report on "community spread"? Why do they not allow people to visit loved ones with the virus? It's the most basic logic--you avoid areas where there was contact. I'm no martry--thousands of people in this area are in the same position as me. Might not HAVE to work, but going to if legal/possible. If that's the case, why would we go to places that are guaranteed to have been exposed to the virus? If the virus were EVERYWHERE, on every surface and in every single location--there would be a complete lockdown. No movement, no work. That's not the case. Not everyone has the virus. There are pockets where it's spread, and pockets where it hasn't. Will it spread to everywhere? Maybe. But it hasn't YET. And in that window of time, where we can work and move around, I for one would like to know specifically where to avoid and where is MORE safe. Again, I'm far from alone in that feeling. You need to apply some logic here and remind yourself like I've tried to remind you--not everything is black/white. In fact, most things in most cases are very gray. Information plays a huge role in navigating that gray area successfully. Whether coronavirus, career, family--anything related to daily life. Information is power.
Sorry, I don't know the Clark movie reference. By the 1980s I was already falling behind on zeitgeist, though it was when I belatedly came to parenthood and became knowledgeable and a fan of animated feature films. The Little Mermaid and The Lion King rank high in my favorites of all sorts of films.
I have news for you, junior. There will be a complete lockdown, and it probably will come in a matter of two to four weeks. You still don't seem to grasp the exponentials of a pandemic. The virus is loose in the population. Of course medical authorities want to know when they identify an active case where that person has been and with whom the person has been in close contact. That way they can track down people and alert them them. But, because of our bone-headed president, we are so far behind the curve on even distributing tests around the country, we have no idea how much Covid-19 there is. Looking at every other country that has had earlier outbreaks, the mathematics tell us that the U.S. probably has at least ten times the number of cases that we know of, probably far higher. There are no "known" places to avoid. It is likely that most places you get gas or groceries already has been patronized by many people carrying the virus. We are not at the stage of following health protocols of people and places keeping surfaces as clean as possible and people working at and patronizing these places doing the best they can to wash their hands constantly to try to foil the virus.
China had a brutal effort to suppress the virus in cities and regions with a total of 60 million people. It worked, and it worked partially because they could in those cases build hospitals overnight and staff them adequately with personnel and equipment like ventilators. Italy, which has a population of about 60 million, has not done so well despite heroic efforts, and its rate infection, rather than stopping, continues to climb with a terrible death rate. The death rate is in part because it doesn't have adequate numbers of hospital beds, medical staff and equipment like ventilators, so people are being triaged and dying at a high rate. Chew on this, my fine Trump supporter. The U.S. per capita has far fewer hospital beds than Italy, and ditto for health personnel and equipment like ventilators. Trump, meanwhile, says he is mobilizing us like never before, but he has done nothing to increase hospital capacity, medical personnel and, especially, ramping up on the order needed the medical supplies desperately needed, from coronavirus test kits to masks (not even enough for hospital workers) to respirators. A couple of weeks ago he was boasting daily that he had it all under control. Now he is on television daily sh*tting bullets, trying to lay our unpreparedness off on to everybody but himself.
It takes but a couple of weeks, once the infection rate reaches a couple of hundred thousand, to soar into the millions, and then our healthcare system will not be able to cope with the crush. People will not only die from coronavirus, others will die waiting for overtaxed ambulance services after suffering a heart attack or a serious injury. Cancer patients awaiting crucial surgery will die while waiting even longer for it.
And you, dear boy, want to identify which Kwik Trip the most recently identified Covid-19 patient stopped at? Do you think a diagnosed Covid-19 patient, not being publicly identified, is going to try to trick you into coming to her home for a visit and a bite of her apple so that you get it, too?
There are plenty of protocols to follow to avoid getting hit by this virus. Follow them. I expect within the next couple of weeks they won't just be suggested protocols, they will be enforced by law as we face huge numbers of people coming down with this illness.
The information I just gave you is out there. I don't know what you are doing for yours, but Rush Limbaugh is not a good source.
It's activists like you that are creating the mass hysteria. President Trump closed the border from China on January 30th which saved tens of thousands of infections according to Dr Facui and many other doctors. However, anti Trumpers (I include you) totally ignore that fact. Instead, if we recall, he was called a racist by his detractors and a xenophobe by your candidate, Joe Biden! President Trump didn't wait 6 months to enforce a National Emergency, like Obama did with the H1N1 outbreak which cost over 1000 American deaths. Obama administration also never replaced the huge number of masks they used during his administration. Our President Trump closed the US/European border soon after to protect us, very once again he was attacked and ridiculed by his detractors and liberal news media. This President is the first leader that has united our government with private industry to work better, faster and more effectively than ever before. Yet, those naysayers like yourself, expound your negative talking points to disrespect our leader. Democrat governors from New York, California etc..are thanking him for his quick action and support. Hospital ships are being activated to help on both coasts to alleviate overcrowding and industry is making masks, ventilators medicine as quickly as posdble. It's shameful how to attempt to create panic with your unfounded attacks and use this critical point in our lives as your weapon! My family is forced to stay at home with no income....the hopeful much needed financial support our Congress was to approve has been stopped twice by your Democrats. Pelosi and Schumer want to include subsidies for windmills and solar panels and air emissions etc...that have nothing to do with helping unemployed families struggling to buy food and pay bills! I urge you to tone down your hatred and support our country and our President so we all can get through this. Hysteria and panic calling people dumb only creates more hardship.
Well, Bobby my boy, I am SO flattered! You consider me an activist? I am a fat, slow moving old retiree. Do you see me in the vanguard of protest, waving the flag of revolution as I lead masses of people down streets? A gratifying image. Other than sitting in on our weekly cell meetings at an undisclosed establishment on Third Street, I seldom rub elbows with fellow revolutionary moderate Democrats. Which reminds me, due to Covid-19, I want to remind my fellow collaborators John's is temporarily closed every night, including Wednesday nights. We should consider meeting online. Facetime?
It WAS impressive how our president closed and locked the doors to travelers from China a few weeks after the virus already had arrived on these shores. The man has been uncanny in his response to this crisis. He calmed down the nation for weeks, wisely reassuring us that Covid-19 was no threat at all, that he had it under control within our borders. Then, when it became obvious that it was getting out of control, he acted decisively and reassured us that he knew all along it was a dangerous pandemic, and we had better get busy fighting it. Why, he even says pretty much daily that if he wanted to, he could invoke the Defense Production Act to galvanize industry into action to start producing the massive amounts of medical devices we are in desperate short supply of, but, danged if he doesn't think out of the box! He refuses to invoke it. And he is getting, as you suggest a very loud and rousing response for all his efforts from the nation's governors. New York Gov. Cuomo yesterday was typical of that response when yesterday he was caught on video angrily and loudly demanding that Trump get off the dime and use the act to get industry moving to alleviate the desperate shortages.
I hesitate, Bobby, to disagree with you, as you come to the argument armed to the teeth with such unusual facts. How many Americans died due to H1N1 do you say? Shocking! If that is true, it was the least fatal flu season in history, making the Obama effort a wonderful success. As I recall, the Obama administration was pushing the nation and the medical community to gear up for H1N1 six months before that flu hit the U.S. I guess I must be wrong, huh?
I am SO embarrassed that I have not been giving Trump credit for uniting his administration with business. I should have known from the tax break he gave to corporations and billionaires that he has been so close to the business community that he actually is in BED with them! My bad. And now the Democrats in Congress are trying to make the administration put down some rules in writing that the half a trilllion or so it wants to give to corporations in stimulus funds must be spent on efforts of employing and paying workers, and cannot be used for buying back company stock to enrich executives with big bonuses. What boneheads those Democrats are, standing up for workers like you who need work right now. Shame on them.
I totally accept your tongue-lashing here, Bobby. I will try to do better in the future. I hope, at least, I have done better here by not calling anybody dumb.
12,000 Americans died from swine flu during Obama's tenure--no shut down of the economy and society. Maybe he DID handle it better after all. Well regardless, Trump's approval rating IS at an all time high and Democrat leaders are publicly praising him in the daily. So maybe he's doing just fine given the incredibly complex circumstances and uniquely difficult challenges he's facing. The best move he could make now is doing whatever it takes to buy Americans a few more weeks financially, do whatever it takes to prepare hospitals, and then reopen the country around Easter like he says. So that we don't collapse.
We have gone over this before, D, but this time I want you to get back to me to answer what I am about to tell you:
The H1N1 pandemic was a totally different thing than the current Covid-19 pandemic. To begin with, it was first noticed in the very early months in 2009 in the southern hemisphere -- Australia, especially -- not on Dec. 1, 2009, when the first Covid-19 case appeared in 2019, just four months ago.
That means that we had a lot more time to prepare for it. And guess what? The Obama administration started gearing up for it right away, organizing stockpiles of material, getting hospitals and medical infrastructure throughout the country to prepare for what was certain to be an overwhelming influx of flu patients late in 2009 and early 2010. It turned out to be a flu strain never seen before, like Covid-19, but it seemed to be no more fatal than ordinary seasonal flus. The concern was, however, that there was no vaccine developed for it. But, with half a year head start, by September one was found. There was no need to shut down the economy and tell people to stay at home for that virus. The big strain was getting sufficient quantities of vaccine manufactured and distributed to protect first the most vulnerable people and medical personnel, then the population at large, and by mid-winter it was possible for most to get the vaccine, as I recall. The other crisis from H1N1 is that hospitals were for a time close to being overwhelmed with flu-stricken patients, and the lack of sufficient lung machines like ventilators. Sound familiar? Another problem was the anti-vaxxers, who were protesting like crazy that they didn't want the vaccine, they were willing to take their chances.
The upshot is this -- the H1N1 pandemic, while deadly in other parts of the world, was to some extent contained here. I am no medical expert, so I don't know if it was due to efforts by the Obama administration, but something less than 12,000 people were killed by H1N1 in 2009-2010. Normal flu season usually kill 30,000 to 50,000 in this country. In 2018, flu killed 80,000 Americans. The Democrats, so far as I know, took no credit for the lower number of H1N1 deaths in 2009-2010. And they, to my knowledge, have never attacked Trulmp because a startling number of 80,000 died from flue in 2018 under Trump's watch.
Now, have I politicized this, or have you?
If this current outbreak results in over 12,000 deaths and 60 million infected in the US, are you going to change your stance on Trump's handling if it? Going to praise him? Either you will have to, or, you'll have to equally criticize Trump and Obama. I've personally changed my stance. I now believe Obama handled it right, considering our economy didn't shut down. We'll see what Trump does but hopefully he follows the Obama method and weighs the medical vs. economic cost.
I would think if we see those numbers at the end of the Covid-19 pandemic we could all say that we ducked the bullet, D. I most certainly would not give credit to Trump, however. He every step of the way resisted taking the necessary steps to suppress transmission of it, being dragged kicking and screaming into it. If anything, it was the governors and local officials who listened to the federal health authorities and put into action the shut down orders. Trump came in at the 11th hour and said not only "Me, too", he now wants to claim total credit for everything he did not do. And now he is trying to a political ad that is comprised solely of his own words coming out of his own mouth that is an iron-clad record of how he ignored the pandemic until it may have been too late.
Let's turn the tables here, D. Now knowing the facts of H1N1, are you willing to give Obama and his administration for keeping their eye on the ball on that pandemic, alerting the public early on and taking broad, aggressive measures to build up the national health infrastructure to confront it? How about it?
Trump's ratings are the highest they have been, his approval for the handling of the crisis remains well over 60% and he's recieved public praise during this crisis from everyone from Cuomo to Cortez to Omar to Schumer. When you say he's failing--there is hard, cold evidence to completely crush your argument.
So you will resort now to citing Trump's approval ratings while they are high, ignoring them when they are low? Trump has the bully pulpit right now. He gets on television and turns what are supposed to be daily informational bulletin boards into his personal political campaign platform. People are scared. They see him surrounded by experts. They don't quite yet connect the dots, that he is telling them reassuring lies, and the experts around him have to hem and haw and mildly correct his misinformation. This will change with time. He will be called on for all his lies.
And the sky is not falling. I'm still not worried. If I was, I'd stay home. My kids still go to daycare. If I was worried, they wouldn't be. As long as information is available, I'll use it and go day by day. I don't fall into a silo of thought and action just because someone says to or because it's easy to do. I calculate risks, have contingencies, use information to navigate the gray area. Until it becomes illegal to do so or I determine the risks are too high. Again--info is the key.
There is information, dear boy, that is misinformation. You have proven yourself to be an avid consumer of it. You do so at the risk of yourself and, especially, of your children.
Bobby and D, Don't bother with Old Homely he is a old man who likes to here himself talk, you know the type. Just look at his on and on writing. I still want him write and explain how he lives with himself after dodging the Vietnam war by going to collage (that he self admitted on this board, he did not want to). I guess mommy and daddy made and paid for him to go to keep there baby boy safe. Now some say they just didn't believe in the war and could not do it (more like coward under the idea in his case). But he did go to Vietnam, not to fight like others his same age were doing, dying, getting wounded and maimed, he went there to make money off of the war and he did, lots of it. These are his own words he wrote on this board at different times to brag on himself on different issues. I guess he just never thought anyone was smart enough to put it all together, but we did. Now while he said he was very successful he had to work until he was 72 because he was broke, why who knows, but I can guess. He left the company he worked for after he forced them to pay a severance to get rid of him (basically held them hostage for his needs). Now he lives on SS and a small little pension. Now you know why he writes for the liberals for without government he is so screwed. OldHomey what goes around comes around and you still have yet to pay for what you did in Nam. Now go ahead and attack me because everything I have put in words, are from your own words, on this board. NOW SHUT UP, DRY UP, AND GO AWAY!!! No one listens to you.
Oh, Ricky! Your angry words cut to the quick! I am SO relieved, however, to say something true for once. Speaking for yourself, you say no one listens to me. That is probably largely true, but it certainly is true in your case, as you have spun this wonderfully exotic biography of me that you say you have cleverly pieced together from things I have said on these boards. It would be an impressive feat, but, sadly, I have never said any of the things you say I have said.
But -- and sadly for you, because I was only a serious beer drinker in my life and never did drugs -- being a guy who came of age in the 60s, I could really groove on your observation that I am one "who likes to here" myself talk. Deep, man. And probably I like to sea myself in mirrors, too, by your estimation. Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds, man. Flour Power, to you. Trippy. Who has to go away when you can mind travel like Ricky?
Pot meet kettle.
Do you really mean that, Tim? Are you being sincere with that Pot meet kettle post? I am SO honored! To be compared to a giant Ricky -- just to be mentioned in the same sentence as him -- makes me feel like my life has not been in vain, or vane or vein or whatever way you want to say it. I have used all three incorrectly at various times in my long life, and I have bled a little, felt directionless and suffered in low self-esteem each time. Not Ricky. He could care less, and if a great or grate man like that doesn't care, why should I? You have made my day.
Thanks Rick....I agree, Oldhomey is an old dog that refuses to accept the truth. I bet he still thinks Hillary won the election! Speaking of open borders Hillary and Biden....the borders would still be open if they were in charge! We shall overcome this Wuhan Virus! I still wonder why the Wuhan Level#4 Bio Lab was developing this virus....maybe working on a cure for cancer? Not!
I don't care about anyone's personal life on here. I save that for people I know personally. I know that all of us are flawed, all of us (except Johnnybrigatti) have good qualities. I believe many people read these comments who never comment. I speak to these people equally or even more than I do to any individual. I am subjected to personal attacks often. I view those as victories. Since that means my point on a subject can't be beaten. That's why I am here. I probably won't be long, as I think Oldhomey is going to win our bet due to my underestimating the spread of covid 19 in massive cities like New York. But as long as I'm here that's my approach.
Ah! So THAT is why you ignore real information in preference to the internet echo chamber music that buttresses your arguments with falsities, fantasies and misinformation. You can have actual facts arrayed before you, but you embrace your own alternative reality and declare "I win!" because it makes you feel good. Impressive. You certainly are worthy of being in the company of Bobbyd and Ricky Boy. Peas in a pod.
Real information?? Oh yes! Because your biased sources MUST be "real" because everyone who associates with the left is pure and righteous...they disregard profits and self-gain completely and truly care about the common good ahead of personal agendas. Right! My goal here isn't to win. There's no winning with people who are completely closed minded to different opinions and outlooks. My goal is to provide an argument to neutral readers stemming from my own personal experience and point of view as a middle class, hard working, family oriented person living in a liberal dominated area. When I debate a point, and the other party breaks down into personal attacks and party line talking points, I know the neutral readers sees defeat.
D, let me clue you in on something. Nobody knows who you are, what your business is, where you live, who your family is. How, then, could anybody make a personal attack on you? You seem to be upset because you come on here, state your views that are rarely, if ever, backed up by any actual facts or visible reality, and people call you on it. You display a narrow little mind, mercenary and showing little if any sense of caring about other people or their circumstances. That much we -- a least I -- know about you. You mewl like you are feeling victimized on here. You victimized yourself.
In the press conf. The county nurse used the words "isolation" and "quarantine" but NEVER defined either one. She said those who tested positive were in isolation. Can you ask her to define what she means by these terms and what it means for those who tested positive and those they have come in contact with I the past two weeks. She was vague.
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